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Kaypro 4 and strange behavior with certain CP/M games.

LiqMatrix

LiqMatrix

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 2, 2017
Messages
687
As some of you know I recently acquired a Kaypro 4 and have been in the process of restoring it, which I am very close to done. I have a question about the different model Kaypro machines and how they display characters.

As an example i tried out a handful of text based games and some work great without issue while others either don't display properly or control properly.

Pacman.com and Catchum.com display properly and control properly without issue.

catchum.jpgpacman.jpg

Where the problem starts is Aliens.com and Clone.com both display characters that are obviously wrong. They both are a mess on screen. Is the Kaypro 4 just not compatible with these games?

aliens.jpgclone.jpg

And then I have the game Qix.com which displays correctly, but the controls just do not work at all or at most it will work just for a second and then stop responding to the keyboard.

qix.jpg
 
beit that the kaypro 4 and kaypro 4/83 ran different versions and formats of CP/M possibly you just need a different version.
 
I tried Kaypro IV CPM v2.2F and Kaypro II CPM v2.2 with the same results so I will keep trying different versions I suppose.

With the Qix.com control problem the inf file states I need to run an install. Anyone know what this means?

It reads:

"TERMINAL INSTALLATION

Before you use this program, it must be installed to your particular
terminal, i.e. provided with information regarding control characters
required for certain functions such as cursor control, screen clear,
etc. This installation is easily performed using the program contained
in TURBOINS.LBR available elsewhere on this system."
 
I suspect the display issue is that the programs need to be "ported" to the Kaypro screen control codes. The terminal emulation should be an extended ADM3, but that is implemented in the ROM so CP/M version should not matter. The same goes for keyboard mapping, although I would expect these programs to use standard ASCII codes? or do they pretend to accept cursor keys? BTW, CP/M versions are generally paired with ROM version, although there is some compatibility between certain versions. You could get into trouble booting CP/M versions that are not intended for your ROM version.

There should be a Kaypro User's Guide that describes the screen control codes as well as the keyboard codes. You'd have to use that, in conjunction with whatever describes how the games are adapted to various terminals, in order to complete the configuration. Sounds like some of them had separate programs used to configure the terminal type.
 
Hmmm. I have a Kaypro 4. It has a graphics mode and I have some graphic games (I have an idea Aliens might be one of them, but I'd need to check). As another person said, is it a Kaypro 4 or a Kaypro 4/83? I don't know anything about the latter but maybe your model doesn't have a graphics mode? This would explain why ASCII games work and others do not.

Tez
 
I had missed the possibility it was a model 4 (vs. model 4/83 or 4/84). The models II and 4 had pretty limited video capabilities - I believe only reverse video. It's possible some of the screen distortion is ESC sequences that are not recognized. Still, the games could be ported to the capabilities of your Kaypro screen, if they allow for that sort of thing.
 
This is my motherboard if this helps. I am still very new on the Kaypro systems so you tell me what system I have. It has Kaypro 4 on the side of the case. I thought most Kaypro systems were text only except for maybe the very last models??? When you say graphics are you saying some models only did basic text and others did ASCII graphics? Thanks for the help.

kaypromobo.jpg
 
liqmat said:
This is my motherboard if this helps. I am still very new on the Kaypro systems so you tell me what system I have. It has Kaypro 4 on the side of the case. I thought most Kaypro systems were text only except for maybe the very last models??? When you say graphics are you saying some models only did basic text and others did ASCII graphics? Thanks for the help.
Click to expand...

Not graphics using ascii characters. Bit-mapped ones. Here is my Kaypro 4 motherboard. Different from yours.

Kaypro 4 board.jpg

Tez
 
BTW on my case, it definitely says Kaypro 4 rather than IV. Gotta love Kaypro's eccentric naming conventions!

kaypro4-118450-side.jpg

kaypro4-118450-back.jpg

Tez
 
I see. So the games will run on mine, but wont display correctly. I am guessing Aliens and Clone are using your 160x100 graphics mode. Strange my older 4 would even try to display it in characters. Oh well, just wanted to make sure my system didn't have something faulty going on. Thanks for your help.
 
By the way, my case looks exactly the same on the side, but you have the newer model with more ports on back and a fan. Mine is obviously much more primitive and this completely makes sense now why some of these games are just not looking right.
 
liqmat said:
This is my motherboard if this helps. I am still very new on the Kaypro systems so you tell me what system I have. It has Kaypro 4 on the side of the case. I thought most Kaypro systems were text only except for maybe the very last models??? When you say graphics are you saying some models only did basic text and others did ASCII graphics? Thanks for the help.

View attachment 43191
Click to expand...

The motherboard is definitely a Kayrpo II/4 vintage, limited video capabilities.

The later models (2X, 4/83, 4/84, 10, ...) had an LSI CRT controller chip and some had an additional custom LSI chip. One of the features was a large-pixel graphics mode where each character cell was divided into 2 pixels wide by 4 pixels down. By figuring out the right binary patterns, you could write each character cell appropriately and display any pattern. The ROM also provided some routines to interpret ESC codes to plot single pixels, and maybe even draw lines. I'm not sure what a Kaypro II/4 ROM will do if you send it graphics ESC codes. Probably gobble part of the ESC sequence and any extra characters just pass through to the screen.
 
durgadas311 said:
That one is a Kaypro 4/84 (2X) motherboard. That one includes the RTC, Modem, and even the hard-disk interface. Plus the advanced CRT capabilities.
Click to expand...

Yes, and with the adapter mentioned in another thread can be used with the FreHD hard drive emulator. I added one to my 2X.
 
tezza said:
Hmm.. Here is mine. You can see the graphics mode.
https://youtu.be/2LO6Pv2IXxc?t=19m45s

Maybe it's not Aliens I'm running, but some other space invader clone? It's been a while. I can't check unless I drag out the Kaypro 4 (which I can't do right now).

Tez
Click to expand...

I see you responded to another Kaypro user who was having similar trouble here:

http://www.vcfed.org/forum/showthread.php?50554-KayPro-II-and-Aliens-com

Also it lists the Aliens game as a text only game here:

http://www.wikiwand.com/en/Aliens_(Kaypro_video_game)

I am beginning to wonder if there aren't two different versions floating out in the wild.
 
liqmat said:
This is my motherboard if this helps. I am still very new on the Kaypro systems so you tell me what system I have. It has Kaypro 4 on the side of the case. I thought most Kaypro systems were text only except for maybe the very last models??? When you say graphics are you saying some models only did basic text and others did ASCII graphics? Thanks for the help.

View attachment 43191
Click to expand...

Id have to open mine to find out, but I think the 4/83 is very much similar to the kaypro II. My Kaypro 4 has an onboard modem (so the transformer sticks out at you when you open it) and the Battery for the RTC. Yours doesnt have that so it looks like a 4/83
Kaypros naming convention is awful, the kaypro II should be the kaypro I, the kaypro 4/83 should be called the kaypro II.. Its pretty confusing if you try and follow. someone did a video covering it on youtube.
 
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