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Ideal conditions for storing computers

P

ppo

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Mar 22, 2009
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I have recently got the oportunity to build an outside house in which plan to store my computers (only the most recent, the Amiga stays protected), but I have noticed that it tends to get very hot.

As I'm getting out of space to store things at home, It is really necessary, but I fear for the state of the computers.

So, this may be a bit basic, but what is the range of temperatures and humidity that a computer can deal with and still keep working?

I'm looking for info regarding old computers (1985-1999).


Thanks
 
Ideal is about 20C, 40% relative humidity, no UV light, filtered air, no ozone. How far you go off that depends on your expectations and on the equipment. Higher temperatures may not prohibit operation but will shorten component life materially.
 
he's looking for something cool, dry, and low humidity? I would try a 53' Ocean Container, the refrigerated kind. Those are insulated VERY well and all you'd have to do is run a DE-humidifier one hour a day. Least here in Washington, i know someone who does that and his collection holds up famously
 
Dig a basement. If you cans store fruits and veggies there without them spoiling fast then computers, software, and books should be ok. A dozen feet below the surface tends to not have much of a temperature drift, same with humidity unless you have leaks. Any caves in the area?';)
 
Unknown_K said:
Dig a basement. If you cans store fruits and veggies there without them spoiling fast then computers, software, and books should be ok. A dozen feet below the surface tends to not have much of a temperature drift, same with humidity unless you have leaks. Any caves in the area?';)
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Yep. I keep my stuff in the basement (finished and sealed) and it's just about perfect. A dehumidifier might be a good addition if you're prone to high humitidy.
 
I have already thought about a basement, but I'm now living in a farm (got to have room for all those computers;)) in a place which has a lot of water.

The place where I'm living is above a large quantity of groundwater, at low depth, so if you dig 1 meter or even less, water starts pouring.

So, there's no chance of building a basement.

I have also a lot of humidity, but I have a dehumidifier.

The computers are already there and fortunately the weather has been cooler, so everything is ok.

Soon I'll post some pictures of my computers (finally) out of their boxes.
 
In that case make sure the floor of this outside house is sealed (concrete?). Water can and will come through concrete which will affect humidity and maybe short out any wiring you have on the floor.

A small wall mounted air conditioner will keep the room cool and also lower humidity. I hope you have some decent electrical service put in. You also might want to dedicate an area for shelving to store spare parts, software, etc if you are going through the trouble of building something.
 
Ground water tends to be somewhere around 10C, doesn't it? You could pump ground water through a heat-exchanger (e.g. an old auto radiator) with some forced-air and have a much lower electricity expense than by using a traditional air-coupled window air conditioner. The setup would tend to keep the same temperature year-round. De-humidifying could be done only as needed.
 
Chuck(G) said:
Ground water tends to be somewhere around 10C, doesn't it? You could pump ground water through a heat-exchanger (e.g. an old auto radiator) with some forced-air and have a much lower electricity expense than by using a traditional air-coupled window air conditioner. The setup would tend to keep the same temperature year-round. De-humidifying could be done only as needed.
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Yep, 10C or 50F even here in AZ.
What you're talking about would be like a geothermal ground source heat pump system which is commonly used in the mid & eastern US for bldgs such as schools, and is becoming more common for other building types. (heat pump - not just forced air, because you have to use it for heating and cooling or the geothermal well will give up the ghost in a few years). You're on the right track Chuck - it's green and popular.

But for capital and operating costs, by the time he drills a well, installs all the heat exchanger and piping, uses elecricity to run a pump and a fan motor for the forced air, he might as well use a split-system like I use in my garage in the summer. (EG: Mitsubishi Mr. Slim - great for spot cooling of troublesome rooms, can do heating and cooling, is dead quiet, doesn't use much electricity, and only needs 120V). He probably wouldn't need a dehumidifier, as the A/C pulls the moisture out of the air as part of the cooling process.
$ 3,000 installed, and a drop in the bucket compared to building a separate room/addition.
(I'm not selling them, I just think they're a great solution to certain problems).
 
Lorne said:
But for capital and operating costs, by the time he drills a well, installs all the heat exchanger and piping, uses elecricity to run a pump and a fan motor for the forced air, he might as well use a split-system like I use in my garage in the summer. (EG: Mitsubishi Mr. Slim - great for spot cooling of troublesome rooms, can do heating and cooling, is dead quiet, doesn't use much electricity, and only needs 120V). He probably wouldn't need a dehumidifier, as the A/C pulls the moisture out of the air as part of the cooling process. .
Click to expand...

(Lorne knows whereof he speaks--he does HVAC for a living)

Lorne, are there any small-scale geothermal setups? I keep thinking abou that high ground water level that the OP has. (I wish I had his problem; the water table where I live is at least 50-60 m down. 150+ m wells are not uncommon here).
 
you don't necessarily need a well to use a geothermal system, I worked for a while installing systems that use a sealed loop system, multiple boreholes are drilled and loaded with loops of poly pipe. They are then tied together with a header and connected to the heat pump. The sort of systems that we were installing were for residential heating and cooling, and tended to be quite expensive by the time the drilling and installation was all said and done.

In the course of becoming certified to install these systems I learned of something called a "slinky system", which uses a fairly tightly coiled length of pipe in a trench as the ground loop of the system. Due to the intensity of this coil on the ground they are not recommended for most applications, but for systems performing cooling only they are commonly used due to the savings in installation. Their big hang up was that the warmpth of the coils (in a cooling application) would dry out the ground, ruining the efficiency of the system, but this could be avoided by irrigating the coils with a weeping tile fed by roof drainage. These systems are apparently commonly used for cooling airport radar equipment buildings.

Perhaps that would be a more attractive route for computer storage areas requiring primarily cooling and dehumidification.
 
chalackd said:
In the course of becoming certified to install these systems I learned of something called a "slinky system", which uses a fairly tightly coiled length of pipe in a trench as the ground loop of the system. Due to the intensity of this coil on the ground they are not recommended for most applications, but for systems performing cooling only they are commonly used due to the savings in installation. Their big hang up was that the warmpth of the coils (in a cooling application) would dry out the ground, ruining the efficiency of the system, but this could be avoided by irrigating the coils with a weeping tile fed by roof drainage. These systems are apparently commonly used for cooling airport radar equipment buildings..
Click to expand...
I have a neighbor with that kind of system attached to his 3 heat pumps. Unfortunately, he's on a hillside and soil conditions are far from stable (the soil here is dense clay that springs leaks and turns to goop during the winter rains). He's had the ground loop replaced twice in about 10 years.

It seems that where land isn't at a premium, it might be better to dig a quarter- to half-acre pond, say about 10-15 feet deep and toss the loop in that. The excavation work would probably cost about the same. Stock it with fish and use it as a reservoir for wildfile defense.

Just thinkin'...
 
Just make sure that when you are storing an Amiga that you fix the bigger problem than heat/humidity and that's the silly NiCD batteries that will leak and destroy the system.
 
Chuck(G) said:
Lorne, are there any small-scale geothermal setups? I keep thinking abou that high ground water level that the OP has. (I wish I had his problem; the water table where I live is at least 50-60 m down. 150+ m wells are not uncommon here).
Click to expand...

OK, some clarification is required.

Chuck(G) seems to have been thinking about using actual well water for cooling. Possible, but not that good an idea as ground water will start growing all sorts of nasty stuff in the pipes and your heat pump – it would have to be filtered constantly which would be a maintenance headache. Plus, the water table may be too low.

When I’m talking “well” it’s not to use the water you might find at the bottom of the well. It is as chalackd mentions; a well with loops of poly pipe in it. That pipe is filled with glycol and water, and that mixture is kept totally separate from any ground water in the well. The heat pump itself is essentially using the ground (which stays at a constant temperature) to reject heat. If you have 70F water coming from your heat pump to the well, and cool it to 50F by using the ground, you’ve picked up a 20F delta T, using only the energy of a pump circulating the water/glycol mix. You can’t just add heat to the ground though, as over time you’ll end up “baking” the ground (you’ll raise the temperature of the ground above 50F). You have to use it for heat rejection during the summer, and extract heat from it in the winter (for the northern hemisphere).

I’ve seen vertical well systems, and the horizontal well systems. NIST is currently building what they call their NetZero Energy Residential building, which uses three geothermal systems; the vertical bore wells, a horizontal “slinky tube” system, and a horizontal trench system with straight pipes laid in the trench, all to test performance under various conditions.

So you want a residential geothermal system?
I hope you plan on staying in the house for a long time.
Here’s the math: In the PNW you’ll need 1 ton of cooling per 400 sf of house (325 here in the desert). A vertical bore well will provide 1 ton of cooling per 160’ of well. The well, and its piping, flushed and filled, will run between $ 15/lf and $ 20/lf. So, for a 2000 sf house you’d be looking at 5 tons of cooling = 800’ of well = $ 12,000 to $ 16,000. You’ll know what your electricity bills are, can estimating what portion of those bills are for heating and cooling (vs lights, dryers, etc), and can calculate the payback in years. It can take a while.

Clarification: you wouldn't drill an 800' foot well - you'd use four 200' wells.
 
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channelmaniac said:
Just make sure that when you are storing an Amiga that you fix the bigger problem than heat/humidity and that's the silly NiCD batteries that will leak and destroy the system.
Click to expand...

The Amiga stays at home no mather what, as it is what I've spent most money in 'till now (most of my computers were given to me or "borrowed" from recycling centers).

But thanks anyway.
 
Lorne said:
OK, some clarification is required.

Chuck(G) seems to have been thinking about using actual well water for cooling. Possible, but not that good an idea as ground water will start growing all sorts of nasty stuff in the pipes and your heat pump – it would have to be filtered constantly which would be a maintenance headache. Plus, the water table may be too low.

When I’m talking “well” it’s not to use the water you might find at the bottom of the well. It is as chalackd mentions; a well with loops of poly pipe in it. That pipe is filled with glycol and water, and that mixture is kept totally separate from any ground water in the well. The heat pump itself is essentially using the ground (which stays at a constant temperature) to reject heat. If you have 70F water coming from your heat pump to the well, and cool it to 50F by using the ground, you’ve picked up a 20F delta T, using only the energy of a pump circulating the water/glycol mix. You can’t just add heat to the ground though, as over time you’ll end up “baking” the ground (you’ll raise the temperature of the ground above 50F). You have to use it for heat rejection during the summer, and extract heat from it in the winter (for the northern hemisphere).

I’ve seen vertical well systems, and the horizontal well systems. NIST is currently building what they call their NetZero Energy Residential building, which uses three geothermal systems; the vertical bore wells, a horizontal “slinky tube” system, and a horizontal trench system with straight pipes laid in the trench, all to test performance under various conditions.

So you want a residential geothermal system?
I hope you plan on staying in the house for a long time.
Here’s the math: In the PNW you’ll need 1 ton of cooling per 400 sf of house (325 here in the desert). A vertical bore well will provide 1 ton of cooling per 160’ of well. The well, and its piping, flushed and filled, will run between $ 15/lf and $ 20/lf. So, for a 2000 sf house you’d be looking at 5 tons of cooling = 800’ of well = $ 12,000 to $ 16,000. You’ll know what your electricity bills are, can estimating what portion of those bills are for heating and cooling (vs lights, dryers, etc), and can calculate the payback in years. It can take a while.

Clarification: you wouldn't drill an 800' foot well - you'd use four 200' wells.
Click to expand...


:shock:

Ok that's too much, I'd better buy an AC - simpler, faster and cheaper.

The (little) space where my collection is now is outside the house, so such an investment would be out of question.
 
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Even aboveground, I think you could probably stabilize the temperature with thick walls of rock or concrete, to soak up heat during the daytime and gradually release it after the sun goes down. This wouldn't keep things cool like air conditioning does, but would avoid the sharper swings in temperature and the resulting expansion and contraction that are tough on materials.
 
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