• Please review our updated Terms and Rules here

Pentium 4

VERAULT said:
Pretty sure freedos is an actual OS so not sure what your talking about. IT runs on a f#$cking 5160 XT how can you say its emulation?!?
Click to expand...
Sorry. I retract my statement. I thought freedos was another "run inside windows dosbox kind of thing". I will edit my posts accordingly.
 
Why do people here care so much about this argument is what I'm wondering. If you think Pentium 4 systems are junk, don't like them, and/or think they're not yet vintage then why would it bother you so much to see this section added to include them? Let me flip that argument on it's face - "I think sinclair computers are awful, I hate them. They were made to be cheap when new and they're just not worth using now. There are much better systems from that time and putting effort into using them/developing software for them today is just pointless when that effort could have gone towards the C64 or the Apple II or whatever system instead". While a bit exxagerated, it's true that I don't like the Sinclair systems very much. But I still get why some people do, and I have no problem with that, nor do I have any problem with them having a subforum here. I just never read it because that's not my cup of tea.
So back to the P4 - what's the issue with it being included here? Everyone has a different definition of vintage, a different definition of what's valuable to them, a different area of interest. We're NEVER going to all agree on what the cutoff should be. If it's not your thing, just don't interact there. That's what I do with probably at least half of the subforums here, and I highly doubt any one person here has an interest in every single computer platform covered by this LARGE forum.
So why does it even matter? Why even be against such a thing existing? I just don't get it. Hell, expand it to Core 2 Duo for all I care. I don't consider those vintage, but there are plenty of people building C2D XP gaming boxes. I'm sure some people would balk at the idea of that - but again, how does it affect you? Why is it a problem?
 
VERAULT said:
Pretty sure freedos is an actual OS so not sure what your talking about. IT runs on a f#$cking 5160 XT how can you say its emulation?!?
Click to expand...
Although I should point out: if freedos is a standalone operating system, then you're not going to be running it inside windows 11 to make win98 games work :p
 
3lectr1c said:
Why do people here care so much about this argument is what I'm wondering.
Click to expand...
The short answer is: because we're bored.

Its far less that we(or at least I) care about this argument as it is how badly we want to talk to someone, anyone, about anything at all related to old computer hardware. I don't have any IRL friends who are into this stuff. My wife just thinks its a bunch of junk cluttering my office. And I'm having a super quiet day at work(which as I type this means there's about to be a sev1 any second here).

So we debate the efficacy and value of the Pentium 4 infinitely for no reason other than because its something to talk about. If we were all sitting in a sports bar right now we'd be arguing about football just as insistently. That one's a sport, right?
 
While it's clearly impossible to find a solution that satisfies everyone - I can definitely think of one that would unite us all...in disagreement.
How's this: One combined PC subforum for all. If anyone sees an eBay seller label an item as "vintage", it now automatically becomes fair game.

That would be the truly evil position for forum leadership to take.
 
3lectr1c said:
While it's clearly impossible to find a solution that satisfies everyone - I can definitely think of one that would unite us all...in disagreement.
How's this: One combined PC subforum for all. If anyone sees an eBay seller label an item as "vintage", it now automatically becomes fair game.

That would be the truly evil position for forum leadership to take.
Click to expand...
You're like one of these evil djinns in a DnD campaign who corrupts wishes!!!
 
hunterjwizzard said:
While the hardware itself is not "vintage", it supports running vintage software natively(without emulation). Most(all?) P4s can run win98 with full driver support
Click to expand...

Nope.

Intel depreciated Windows 98 support on the 915 and 925 chipsets and discontinued support entirely on the 94x chipsets. 3rd party chipsets continued support for a bit longer, but they generally weren't stable, or didn't support all system peripherals on Windows 9x.

AMD motherboards were in the same boat, by the time the Athlon XP rolled around, Windows 9x was long in the rear view mirror and didn't have much driver support.
 
Vintage computers are not only hardware but also software that was created in the era when Bill Gates was the director of Microsoft and Steve Jobs was the director of Apple (until 1985).
They have their own history of creation.
Pentium 4 is a completely different era, both in terms of hardware and software.
 
VERAULT said:
Who said anything about windows? I thought we were talking about DOS games? Your confusing things here.
Click to expand...
I guess thats my bad again :p You said "A brand new laptop" which I assumed meant "with factory installed Windows 11" not some other OS. I was also talking about win98 games(hence my own frequent comments about "can boot win98") so I thought we were all on the same page.
 
GiGaBiTe said:
Nope.

Intel depreciated Windows 98 support on the 915 and 925 chipsets and discontinued support entirely on the 94x chipsets. 3rd party chipsets continued support for a bit longer, but they generally weren't stable, or didn't support all system peripherals on Windows 9x.

AMD motherboards were in the same boat, by the time the Athlon XP rolled around, Windows 9x was long in the rear view mirror and didn't have much driver support.
Click to expand...
I have a 925 board with a driver CD that says "windows 98" right on it. They are not hard to find. Even if a particular 925 board by a different manufacturer lacks dedicated drivers, generally you can use the intel ones and it works. 915 & 925 boards are also the cheapest since they are the oldest.

I have not spent much time on AMD boards from that era, IMO they are much better vintage XP machines if you can't afford a Core2Duo or need single-core, but I imagine drivers are more plentiful than you think. You only really need a good chipset driver, LAN and audio are better suited on peripheral cards anyway.
 
hunterjwizzard said:
I guess thats my bad again :p You said "A brand new laptop" which I assumed meant "with factory installed Windows 11" not some other OS. I was also talking about win98 games(hence my own frequent comments about "can boot win98") so I thought we were all on the same page.
Click to expand...
A laptop is a computer. You DONT HAVE TO RUN THE VERSION OF WINDOWS IT SHIPS WITH.
 
VERAULT said:
A laptop is a computer. You DONT HAVE TO RUN THE VERSION OF WINDOWS IT SHIPS WITH.
Click to expand...
It depends a little on the laptop, but yes.

If you've never tried to install a different windows version on a very, very cheap consumer laptop it gets very interesting. Sometimes these machines can't even handle the exact same windows version if it wasn't the image that came from the factory. Its even worse now that restore media simply doesn't exist. Buy a $200 laptop, format it, and it will never work right again.
 
The problem as I see is a few fold. Your vintage isn't someone else's vintage, and your vintage sucks and isn't real is one of exclusion rather than one of, to each their own. Exclusion is akin to elitism, elitists always end up frowned upon, viewed negatively in the context of history and let's face it, just dumb. Elitist are very lonely people due to their intolerance of others.

No more needs to be said, even in mod3rn times when elitism seems to be winning, it will be eventually all viewed as being completely ignorance like extremist history. Diversity always ends up outnumbumbering elitism.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top