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Considering Buying an Abandoned Computer Store – Seeking Advice

If all of this doesn't dissuade you, @rreinke, take the trouble to visit the place and assess the inventory (as well as the physical plant) in person. Do not--I repeat--do not buy a pig in a poke. Approach the whole affair with suspicion and gimlet-eyed. If it hasn't sold in 30 years, there's a reason.
 
Looked at the walk through, there is a lot of non-computer junk in there, and it looks like people have been digging through this stuff already for a while now. Does not look well stored, so probably hit or miss if anything works properly. Only thing that even jumped out at me were some Zip Drive boxes.

Random motherboards laying about, but probably just OEM stuff. Lots of beige dell pentiums that probably need to be taken out back and shot. Lots of keyboards, but can't tell from photos if they are the kinds anyone would want.

As a software guy, I'd look for any uncommon software titles, but no one needs a dozen boxes of some Norton Internet Protection suite.

There could be a few gems left in there, but not likley, and nothing that would make anybody rich.
 
I note that this is in Norman, OK, which makes me wonder if climate control has been operating these 30 years. Probably not--who would pay the utility bills? That's another strike against the deal.
 
From browsing their website on internet archive.
-It was under construction from 1998-2003
-The became an underwhelming e-store from May 2004-October 2016. They appeared to sell mostly accessories and some software focused mostly on business. They did have a few game titles.
-They did sell video cards.

Judging by their e-store, I would have never bought from them back in the day. I might have wandered into a store like this back then and browsed their goods, but without making a purchase.

Also, from reading the trademark for COMPUTER FACTORY OUTLET and a court brief against the owner of the strip mall. It appears the owner of The Computer Factory Outlet and the building are one and the same.
 
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There could be a few gems left in there, but not likley, and nothing that would make anybody rich.

Yeah the OP should be paid for cleanup and not vice versa.
The CRTs if they're functional and have no marks of usage will sell, but slowly. There is also an option to setup a bulk sale to an European trader and ship it in a shared container. There is a scarcity of 17" CRTs on euro ebay, let alone unopened major label ones.

Not everyone is looking for a "gaming CRT" people also want to have a CRT to hook their old computers to. And nobody can set up a new production, like they did with modern Gravis and SB and wavetable clone cards. The numbers are running out, whoever has a stock of unused CRTs is looking at a profit, but not over a short period and not without hassle.
 
Hi all, I talked with the seller, and I guess the owner of the building/store died recently and the whole building is in probate. The place is computer factory outlet, I didn't know this place was sort of internet famous. I also talked with the deceased person's estate lawyer and the person I talked to is a family friend and plans on buying the building in a private sale. The place is trashed on the inside due to some homeless people moving in this past winter when Oklahoma had a very cold freeze this past winter. I also want to thank everyone for their responses! The discussion has been very informative and has curbed my pie-in-the-sky ideas. I'm going to further talk with the estate to see if I can just remove the stuff for free or be paid for the removal. I'll keep you guys updated and thanks again.
 
I note that this is in Norman, OK, which makes me wonder if climate control has been operating these 30 years. Probably not--who would pay the utility bills? That's another strike against the deal.
The electricity/climate control has been off since 2005.
 
I've noticed that the value of a CRT reflects weather or not it's using a Trinitron/Diamondtron jug. The value even of a new CRT is non-linear because of the unrealistic belief that those are the best displays money can buy for gaming. The NEC tubes may sell because they were usually pretty good for multiscan but the boxed Viewsonics may take a while to clear out.

(spoiler alert: You still suck at Counter-Strike. Paying $400 for a "better" monitor isn't going to help you much. Go touch grass, kid.)
 
if this story has already been around the internet.. all we are doing is feeding the hype train. The OP should have known better... Im out.
 
I also look at it this way...

The items in whatever condition with whatever value have been sitting so long because the seller has not been reasonable.

I've run into unreasonable sellers many times. people have unrealistic expectations on actual value or they are sentimentally attached to something and it just sits and rots, in their mind things are just like they were 25 years ago.

thus in this stores case i would bet reasonable offers on the left over inventory have been made for years and the seller refuses to budge on book value or MSRP or what ever they might see on ebay for a single crazy sale.

these situations you know you are not going to be the white knight that swoops in and saves the day or increases their you tube channel traffic for he shock value.

if you saw a few good items for yourself then make an offer on those that i'm sure would be rejected and move on tons of vintage computers hit the market each day.
 
The value even of a new CRT is non-linear because of the unrealistic belief that those are the best displays money can buy for gaming.

I would love to see an actual peer-reviewed study of "monitor lag" and its effect on gaming success. Something tells me you're not going to find a lot there unless the study is sponsored by a company deeply invested selling ZERO LAG 144Hz video products.

I mean, I'll grant it depends on the game. If you're talking about Atari 2600-type fast-twitch contests then, sure, a frame of lag might actually have a scientifically measurably effect on user success (in some of these games high scores depend on hitting the button on an exact 60hz frame), but if we're talking about modern first person shooters.... no. Just, no, especially for multi-player network games. Unless the people you're playing against are in the same room your internet connections' going to have more latency than even the very, very worst lag you'll get out an LCD monitor.
 
I would love to see an actual peer-reviewed study of "monitor lag" and its effect on gaming success. Something tells me you're not going to find a lot there unless the study is sponsored by a company deeply invested selling ZERO LAG 144Hz video products.

I mean, I'll grant it depends on the game. If you're talking about Atari 2600-type fast-twitch contests then, sure, a frame of lag might actually have a scientifically measurably effect on user success (in some of these games high scores depend on hitting the button on an exact 60hz frame), but if we're talking about modern first person shooters.... no. Just, no, especially for multi-player network games. Unless the people you're playing against are in the same room your internet connections' going to have more latency than even the very, very worst lag you'll get out an LCD monitor.
Modern multiplayer games don't work like that. The game predicts where the other players will be until/unless it receives "corrections" from the server. If you have really bad network latency, other players may "jump around", but your own movement will always be smooth.

Regardless of the latency debate, CRTs are also desirable because they can show a range of resolutions without scaling artifacts. Lots of old games are locked in at one resolution.
 
Regardless of the latency debate, CRTs are also desirable because they can show a range of resolutions without scaling artifacts. Lots of old games are locked in at one resolution.
Maybe in the Windows 95/98 era when 640x480 at 256 colors was the norm for games, but before then, PC games frequently used a hodge-podge of different resolutions. For example, the title and menu screens would often be at a different resolution and refresh rate than the game itself. And sometimes they switch rapidly enough that if you use a modern LCD monitor that blanks out for a few seconds while it re-adjusts to the different resolution, you'll miss something important.

Same thing with the BIOS POST screen. Often it goes by so quick that by the time a modern LCD monitor wakes itself up and synchs to the resolution, you've already entirely missed it.
 
And sometimes they switch rapidly enough that if you use a modern LCD monitor that blanks out for a few seconds while it re-adjusts to the different resolution, you'll miss something important.

I've owned multisync CRTs that excused themselves and grabbed a soda when switching resolutions, that's not just an LCD problem. Plain dumb VGA monitors do a pretty good job switching modes instantly on the drop of a hat (or, well, within a couple Vsyncs at least) because they have hard-wired responses to changes in the sync polarity. That ship sailed a *long* time ago.

(This also applies to BIOS post screens. I've dealt with some positively maddening wake-up delays from CRT monitors. Had an old Sony that took like 10 seconds to figure out it was being asked to come out of a coma.)
 
Maybe in the Windows 95/98 era when 640x480 at 256 colors was the norm for games, but before then, PC games frequently used a hodge-podge of different resolutions. For example, the title and menu screens would often be at a different resolution and refresh rate than the game itself. And sometimes they switch rapidly enough that if you use a modern LCD monitor that blanks out for a few seconds while it re-adjusts to the different resolution, you'll miss something important.
Yes, my point is that you often can't change old games to match your native LCD resolution. Whether the title/menu/game use the same mode or not doesn't really matter. It's all fixed.
 
CRT's are great for filling up the screen no matter what resolution you are using. Most old LCD's that are 4:3 have visible screen lag and are stuck at 60Hz. Also, colors are more accurate on a CRT. If you have an old CRT VGA monitor they are always on and have analog controls.

Old consoles have better visuals because they were made for CRT TV viewing and scanlines. Also, if you have a game with a light gun, you are out of luck using it on an LCD.
 
If you have an old CRT VGA monitor they are always on and have analog controls.

The Energy Star 1.0 spec was released in 1994 and most (if not all) computer monitors were compliant within a few years. Within the scope of this thread, well, all the boxed computer monitors in that wrecked store would certainly be Energy Star rated, have power management features, and of course they're all going to be digital multisyncs that take a little time to figure out exactly what mode they need to switch to, just like an LCD.

Most old LCD's that are 4:3 have visible screen lag and are stuck at 60Hz.

I kind of have to say "citation needed" when it comes to "visible screen lag". In what context, and are you arguing it's bad enough to actually get you killed in a video game?

It's generally accepted that human reaction time to "random" stimuli is somewhere in the ballpark of 175-250ms. IE, if you're sitting there staring at your screen finger poised over a fire button waiting to blow the head off a counterstrike opponent it's going to take you about a fifth of a second, at best, to mash that trigger when they pop into view. At 60Hz that's 12 frames. Sure, that's less than the 29 frames you'd get with a 144Hz gamer monitor (and a GPU fast enough to actually saturate it), but let's be serious here: both are much faster than anything you're going to actually be able to respond to. I mean, sure, I guess you could say the faster monitor gives you a *little* bit of an advantage because the *first* frame with the target in it gets to you faster, but what we're talking about here is going to be like 11ms, or about 1/20th of the total average response time... IE, a figure well within the margin of error. While I'm sure there are plenty of butch gamers that will insist they're equipped with the superhuman levels of perception to make use of that, well, color me pretty skeptical.

And to be clear, that's not to say that people can't *perceive* faster events. One of the banes of modern entertainment systems is that humans are really good at noticing mismatches between video and audio sync; the threshold for someone experiencing some level on unconscious discomfort with, say, spoken audio out of sync with the video of mouths moving can be as low as the 10-20ms ballpark, IE, just one 60Hz frame. Older HDTVs could easily exceed this by several times, but... it's worth calling out here that the bulk of these delays involve processing that computer monitors don't do. IE, TVs often have video processors that are simply determined to make things "look better" through deinterlacing, upscaling, motion interpolation, etc. Computer monitors rarely lag by anywhere near as much... and especially if you're using a modern computer, because with DVI and better it's often actually the video card doing the work of scaling non-native resolutions to the panel size instead of a scaler in the LCD.

(My 2006 vintage Apple 30" Cinema Display, which I still use via a USB-C converter, offers two built in resolutions, IE, native and 2x doubled. That's it. All the other resolutions you might choose when it's hooked up rely on the computer to do the work. This isn't really a new thing.)

People seem to forget that the reason that CRT monitors from the 1990's forward offered refresh rates higher than 60hz wasn't because it "made gaming better", it's because a fair number of people (like me) are able to subconciously percieve flickering in color CRT display phosphors at refresh rates lower than 70-85hz. This problem gets worse as CRTs get bigger because human eyes are more sensitive to quick movement in their peripheral vision; a 13" VGA monitor might be just fine at 60hz, but a 19" monitor is going to be constantly telling the edges of your retina to trigger the flight-or-flight reflex because of its greater coverage of the visual field. LCDs don't, or at least shouldn't, flicker. (Old florescent backlights do sometimes, but that's another matter.) The pixels stay whatever color they are until they're changed, so as long as the refresh rate is fast enough to make things "move" it hardly matters. Really old LCD panels themselves could be somewhat sluggish in changing color with updates, IE, if a pixel went from bright white to solid black it might actually take a measurable amount of time (10ms?), which *was* kind of perceptable (I remember old TFT LCDs had this sort of "melty" quality when transitioning one scene to a drastically different one), but... that's a 20 year old problem right there. Monitors are cheap, treat yourself to a new one?
 
Hi all,

I recently stumbled upon an intriguing opportunity: an abandoned computer store. The store spans approximately 6,000 square feet and houses equipment dating back to the late 1990s. Here are the key details:

  • Inventory: The store is fully stocked with an assortment of items, including:
    • Monitors (including ViewSonic models)
    • Late '90s PC expansion cards
    • Enterprise computers from Dell
    • Beige PC towers
    • CIB Software
  • Market Potential: Now, my expertise lies mainly in consumer PCs from the late '90s. However, I’m curious about the market for rodents and the resulting damage. The cost of cleanup may exceed any possible return. Are there collectors or enthusiasts who would appreciate these?
  • Purchasing Offer: The seller is offering to sell the entire lot in one go. Given the vast inventory, I’m hesitant to commit without understanding its value. Unfortunately, a comprehensive inventory would take weeks.

So, I turn to you for advice:
  1. Market Assessment: Is there a demand for late '90s servers and workstations? Any insights on potential buyers or use cases?
  2. Valuation: How can I estimate the worth of this store's inventory? Are there any benchmarks or resources I should consult?


Thank you in advance for your input.
I wish you had more active data of this store inventory, since another forum already replied about rodents and the resulting damage. The cost of cleanup may exceed any possible return. I will leave out how to recover equipment from animal and/or flood damaged.
..
As far as the inventory, is there any diagnostic equipment included with it. Solder rework station
Eprom programmer, PLa Programmed, Disk Duplicator, Tape duplicator, Test equipment (scopes, multimeters, frequence counters and generators), Shelving. With the age of this equipment there will likely be firmware patches that will have to be done to them as well.
..
Do you get the old supplier account information with the equipment sale, and possibly the old business title as well.
If the business had a account with a state run eco station to get surplus/scrap electronic on pallets that would be worth a closes look at. There could also be back taxes own to deal with as well depending how this sale is contracted out to you.
..
Pictures of the existing invertor even if it is just stacks of stuff would be of help deterring their true value.
The big issue is with any computer product that's over 10 years old to get the best return on it, you must be able to do a complete
system updated including the operating system and software rebuild with it. Do you have access to programmers that can updates
the older software and operating systems as well. Do you know how to stress test system and their components so they will last twice your warranty period, or you can sell them ASIS, HOWIS at a reduced price.
..
Market Potential: Yes there is still one for this equipment but the Resorces to it correctly on a budget will be an issue.
As far as a Purchasing Offer, do you have other income to support this ?, Do you have other income (work and/or Etc.,) to
help provide a stable foundation to regain the business lost before the shutdown.

Do you have access to 3rd party resellers who will resell the lower value equipment for you on a commission basis, that really not worth shipping overseas or out of state.
..
Market Assessment: If you have access to 3rd world contracted programmers, foreign buyers of this equipment, Somebody
who can do local commission sales. Have access to somebody that can set up and matain vintage point of sale systems
(made with this existing hardware). Access to wholesalers and hard disk refurbishes. Then you have a good shot at a pretty good return on this hardware. A couple of others are list below - Under a short rule of thumb)
..
Valuation: How can I estimate the worth of this store's inventory? Are there any benchmarks or resources I should consult?
Local Ads like Kaji, and the Bargin Finder (if one still exists in your area). Check the local competitors pricing, including
any auction sales. This will give you a real time price structure.
..
A short general rule of thumb is : (Try to get each system as a ASIS bundle with a printer and other parts thrown in).
Each systems keyboard and mouse with two power cables is $5.00 Cdn.
Each system with HD still installed is from 25,00 to 35.00 each.
Each Monitor from 7.99 (sometimes found at some Value Village stores).
As far as old scanners and printers are concerned $1.00 to 7.00 each. (This is what price I acquire them at local auction sales).
For all equipment not worth fixing/reselling to you have or have access to somebody that can do complete recertify component recovery for resale. Do you have access to somebody that can fix broken plastic parts/Pices as well.
Do you have access to an alternative space for the equipment in case you have to downsize or get evicted.
..

Most of the none IBM or Mac compatible equipment receive that is still working we usually end up using it ourselves in house at various locations instead of scrapping it. There could also be an Income tax advantage to the purpose of this outfit stuff, that's if
it will apply to your federal income tax return status.
..
W
ell I hope this reply helps answer some more of you inquires that other have not fully responded to.
 
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I kind of have to say "citation needed" when it comes to "visible screen lag". In what context, and are you arguing it's bad enough to actually get you killed in a video game?

It's generally accepted that human reaction time to "random" stimuli is somewhere in the ballpark of 175-250ms. IE, if you're sitting there staring at your screen finger poised over a fire button waiting to blow the head off a counterstrike opponent it's going to take you about a fifth of a second, at best, to mash that trigger when they pop into view.
What you're ignoring there is that the stimuli you are responding to in many games are not random events,
any more than arrival of a baseball near you is a random event. Just as you catch a baseball based not on seeing it near your body and putting the mitt in front of it, but by predicting its trajectory and, long before it arrives, moving your mitt to where it needs to be, you watch the environment in games and press the buttons at the right time based on prediction, not reaction. This is most easily seen in platformer games (such as Mario Bros.) where all the moving objects you need to touch or avoid have predictable trajectories that you can see long in advance.

This is also how the "netcode" used in multiplayer network games works; both the server and your computer are running models of all the objects, the server updating its model from inputs from all the players and sending those updates back to the other players. This is why it can, sometimes, look as if you hit something but you later see you didn't; you did hit it in your model but when the server later runs the same actions in its model it has updated information about the other players that doesn't match what was predicted on your computer and so sends back updates to you indicating that you didn't make the hit after all.

So what's important in games, for the most part, is not the human reaction time to random events, but the human ability to predict an event and press the button at the right time in the future which, as you have pointed out later, is more like 10 ms. of accuracy.

...just one 60Hz frame. Older HDTVs could easily exceed this by several times, but... it's worth calling out here that the bulk of these delays involve processing that computer monitors don't do. IE, TVs often have video processors that are simply determined to make things "look better" through deinterlacing, upscaling, motion interpolation, etc. Computer monitors rarely lag by anywhere near as much... and especially if you're using a modern computer, because with DVI and better it's often actually the video card doing the work of scaling non-native resolutions to the panel size instead of a scaler in the LCD.
This might be the case on your Mac (though I don't think it is even there), but certainly isn't for Windows and Linux, which query the monitor for its EDID data and present a list of all the resolutions the monitor supports. If you choose any resolution other than the native panel resolution (which is marked as "preferred" in the EDID data), the computer will send in that resolution and the monitor will need to do a scan rate conversion, which usually involves waiting for a full frame to completely arrive, doing the conversion, and then displaying it, which typically introduces at least two frames of delay, or about 33 ms at a 60 Hz frame refresh rate.
 
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