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DEC Paper Tape Punch/Reader Pricing

NF6X

NF6X

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Riverside, CA, USA
I’d like to add a high-speed punch/reader to my PDP-8M project. I’m drooling over a PC04/PC8E (plus documentation, tapes, and other extras) listing on eBay with an asking price of $9,500. Is that a crazytalk eBay price, or is that in line with the market value of vintage DEC punch/readers in 2024 given their scarcity?
 
I've always been painfully cheap/frugal so before COVID they seemed to sell in the open market for over $1000.
Post-COVID the prices have been off the rails. $2000? $3000 if it includes a carton of fanfold tape and the controller?
Ebay's been increasingly unreliable to value items since you can set a price, park the item and watch the offers roll in over years.
 
Thank you. If enough of them change hands for there to be a going rate, and that going rate is usually around the admittedly off-the-rails post-COVID prices you mention, then I may consider making an offer on it. I guess I should also post in the wanted topic on the off chance that there’s another one out there for me to consider. It’s been a day or three since I asked about DECtape drives, and I have the attention span of a terrier in a field full of squirrels. :)
 
NF6X said:
.. a PC04/PC8E (plus documentation, tapes, and other extras) listing on eBay with an asking price of $9,500. Is that a crazytalk eBay price, or is that in line with the market value of vintage DEC punch/readers in 2024 given their scarcity?
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He originally listed it at $15K, so it's gradually coming into view. The Roytron punch is probably the most valuable part. There are less costly ways to read & punch paper tape on a Omnibus 8. Another option is to just acquire and connect an ASR-33 teletype if you really need paper tape I/O.
 
I already have a 33 ASR which I’ll use as the console for my PDP-8/M. I’m not sure if its keyboard has the right parity and if it is configured the DEC way with two loops plus reader run control, so I may need to tinker with it. I’d like to also add other correct DEC peripherals such as a high speed punch/reader, DECtape, RK05… I probably won’t manage to acquire all of those, and I’m not even sure if they would all fit in the 8/M’s short backplane. But those are the sorts of things I hope to add to it.

My PDP-8/M apparently came out of an automatic stitching machine. Sadly, I just got the computer and not the whole machine. I wonder whether the machine was scrapped, or if it lived on after being retrofitted with a more modern CNC controller? There are some non-DEC cards in my 8/M which presumably interfaced it to the machine, and I think the system originally had some sort of cassette/cartridge tape drive.
 
If you don't care about it being the PC04 specifically you can always use a generic tape reader and/or punch. Those are still expensive, but can be had for tens and hundreds of dollars, respectively, rather than thousands.
 
I have several generic readers and punches from the CNC world. I do care about the PC04 etc. specifically. My level of care doesn’t quite reach $9,500, though. :)
 
Well, it’s not quite working yet. The panel was in bad shape, with lots of lint stuck in the switches (not surprising, considering what it came out of) and most of the switches not working properly. I laboriously disassembled, cleaned, and lubricated each switch several years ago. I think I got the panel working, but then the project stalled out at getting the rest of the computer working. It’s time for me to put it back on the front burner and get the thing working, starting with testing out the power supply. It’s my only machine with core memory, so it’ll be really cool to get it working.

I put an offer on that punch/reader on eBay, but I don’t think that the seller and I will find a mutually agreeable price. So, I’ll probably have to make a PC8E compatible interface for one of my other devices. That should be a fun way to learn about OMNIBUS interfacing.
 
NF6X said:
I also have a PiDP-8 kit on the way right now. Can’t have too many toys!
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I have found that if I have too many to play with and/or fix, it adds to my wife's frustration level which can be bad for my wa.

A friend recommended a good set of noise cancelling headphones.

;-)
 
Just to give you an idea on pricing, I bought a fully serviced, restored and working PC04 with controller (PDP11) for 1500 EUR + shipping a couple of years ago.

To anyone reading: I have a TU56 and need to buy a TC11 controller to use it with my PDP 11/45. If anyone has a lead on one, please let me know. Also looking for a VT52.
 
I like that price a lot better than the asking price on the eBay auction. Granted, their listing appears to include a drool-worthy pile of documentation and tapes and stuff, but even their best offer was too much for me to spend on that sort of thing right now. That reminds me: I should buy a lottery ticket on my way home from work just to see if that situation changes. :)
 
It's a bargain given that a VHS tape for "Beauty and the Beast" goes for $25,000....

Seriously, I had one. No way it's worth that much. When you have loaded OS8 onto an RK08.RK03 from a box of paper tapes you realize just how pointless it can be.
 
RK drive is actually useful, aside from making amazing sounds it will boot an OS and run it well.

High speed paper tape makes a nice woosh woosh sound as it runs the tape from one side and folds it up on the other. But really it does get old quickly and are you really going to copy your RK05 drive to the paper tape punch as a backup? (I guess it can be done)

(Edit: Backing up a RK05 disk to the PTP: would take 30 days assuming you can keep the punch fed with paper tape. Read time for restore however would only be a mere 6 days reading 24*7.)
 
Paper tape is not "useful" anymore. However it is one of the most interesting to people who have never seen it demos. DECtape, mag tape, drum plotters, card operations, paper tape, and line printers all have something in common. They have things that move. They are visually stimulating. Modern computers don't have much of this.

czunit said:
(Edit: Backing up a RK05 disk to the PTP: would take 30 days assuming you can keep the punch fed with paper tape. Read time for restore however would only be a mere 6 days reading 24*7.)
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I am reasonably certain that a PDP-8 equipped with some threshold of memory (maybe 20k) could run compress and that this version of compress could keep up with the 50 cps paper tape punch. This would probably cut your punch time to 1/4 or a little less than 8 days. The HSR being able to go at 350 CPS would make the restore operation at least 7 time faster (decompress is far less computationally intensive) or less than a day.

I have 10 or 11 boxes of fanfold paper tape left in a case. At current consumption levels this is a lifetime supply. I have a BIN loader punched in mylar. I have been looking for something I could use like the mylar to make some permanent tapes for demos. I keep thinking there must be some 1" wide ribbons and I look for this in craft stores. I worry about the punch having issues with substances other than the correct paper tape.

Question: How many DECtapes could fit on a 1TB microSD card?
Answer: Probably all of them! A reel can hold 276k bytes. 1000000000000/282624=3538269 I doubt that there were 3.5 million reels of DECtape manufactured.
 
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