Imaging a non-standard Apple ][ disk (Wanco 8201 controller) with Kryoflux

[mikerofone]

Hi all,

I recently acquired a mystery computer from a local auction, which turned out to be some sort of machine controller built from a 16k Apple ][. I've documented this with tons of pictures here: https://photos.app.goo.gl/Hf6aCHKaDx42Xncg7
The floppy drive in there is a Wangco 82 with a Wangco 8201 controller, and a very custom looking Apple ][ interface card for said controller. The drive and controller are described on pages 9-12 of this archived brochure. See the end of the album above for pictures of my unit.

I would like to backup the single floppy the computer came with, which is still working. On power up, the floppy drive clicks ever second or so in an infinite loop, until a diskette is detected. From said floppy, the computer boots into a BASIC program whose purpose was controlling of some devices connected to the machine. Breaking out of the program with Ctrl+C drops into BASIC, where the source code can be seen using "LIST".

Attempting to make an image with Kryoflux​

I have a Kryoflux and created a flux image using a 360kb PC floppy drive. I am unable however to convert this data into a disk image, and I'm unsure whether it's because I don't know the correct format parameters, or because I'm using the device wrong. Or maybe the Kryoflux software simply doesn't support this format?

The disk is single sided, and from the flux data read it seems to have 35 tracks. The documentation makes it sound like it should be 16 sectors with 128 bytes per track, but I cannot get the Kryoflux software to recognize such a format. Given that the "3a: FM XFD, Atari 8-bit" is the only format that recognizes any sectors, I assume the disk to be FM encoded.
Edit: I've tried inserting an EsDOS ][ boot disk that I created via ADTPro on a Apple ][+ with a (clone) Disk ][ drive. It doesn't seem to be recognized, further suggesting that this is a different format. /Edit

The closest I got to it recognizing something was with this command:

$ dtc -f/tmp/disk.img -m1 -i3a -z1 -e34 -s0 -g0 -k2 -n+16 -v300  -f/tmp/kryoflux_raw/track -i0 -e34 -s0 -z1 -g0 -k1 -n0

Then the output looks like this:

00.0    : frev: 43383, drift: 1.016 us, tfer: 207880 B/s, rpm: 300.086
00.0    : base: 4.010 us [99.778%], band: 4.006 us, 8.021 us
00.0    : FM: <error>, trk: 000, sec: 18, bad: 1, mis: 2, *H
00.0    : Bad sector found
00.0    : Read operation failed
02.0    : frev: 42774, drift: 0.491 us, tfer: 204360 B/s, rpm: 300.087
02.0    : base: 4.008 us [98.739%], band: 4.135 us, 8.016 us
02.0    : FM: <error>, trk: 001[002], sec: 18, mis: 2, *HT +1
02.0    : Bad sector found
02.0    : Read operation failed
...

Note that:

1. It recognizes some sectors!
2. But it seems to expect 18 sectors ("ec: 18, bad: 1, mis: 2"). The "-n+16" parameter seems to be ignored (I expected that to set it to 16 sectors).
3. It skips every other track, the "-k" parameter has no effect.
4. Unsurprisingly, the resulting image file does not look like it contains any real data.

I've attached the raw files in case anyone wants to give converting them a shot.

Thanks for any suggestions you might have. I'd really like to preserve or at least make a copy of the disk.

Cheers
mikerofone

 

[ldkraemer]

How about giving the Kryoflux tutorial a read, as it explains about getting good reads.
Once you are getting correct sectors, stream then to .raw files. That way you can
write the stream back to a fresh floppy.

[HOWTO] - Create Preservation Files of CP/M Boot Floppy's - KryoFlux Support Forums

forum.kryoflux.com

Larry

 

[Eudimorphodon]

Given that the "3a: FM XFD, Atari 8-bit" is the only format that recognizes any sectors, I assume the disk to be FM encoded.

It looks like from the pictures it’s a Western Digital 1771 floppy controller (same as in the TRS-80 Model I) so, yeah, it should be conventional single density. I think that controller did support some nonstandard data address marks (TRSDOS for the Model I used one) that some later controllers couldn’t write, maybe this thing does too.

 

[diskblitz]

I used my Applesauce software and it opened up the raw files just fine, except for 1 bad sector. It is an FM-format disk 16 x 128 byte sectors per track. I exported an IMD file for you. Not much data on the disk and I don't recognize the file system offhand.

 

[mikerofone]

Hey all,

you folks rock, thank you so much! \o/ I have struggled with finding proper documentation for using the Kryoflux correctly, especially for cases where the disk at hand is not of a known format. I always feel like I must be missing an obvious step, as the official documentation goes from "how to connect everything" to "now configure it for the right format" - but what if I don't know what it is? The tutorial ldkraemer linked looks very promising in that regard, thank you very much!
I had somehow completely missed the existence of the Kryoflux forums, but will consult them in the future. (I found https://github.com/archivistsguidetokryoflux/archivists-guide-to-kryoflux but it too felt quite superficial on that part.)

diskblitz, I had found mentions of the Applesauce controller and software, but did not realize it would work on Kryoflux stream files as well. That's very cool to know, luckily I have an old MacBook Air I can run it on (no Linux version)! I'll look into it and will try to reproduce your results so I know how to use it in the future. If I read the UI correctly, it seems like the bad sector wasn't in the actual data section (all tracks are green?) but I might try to read the disk again to get rid of the error.

Thanks again for the help!

Cheers
mikerofone

 

[mikerofone]

How about giving the Kryoflux tutorial a read, as it explains about getting good reads.
Once you are getting correct sectors, stream then to .raw files. That way you can
write the stream back to a fresh floppy.

[HOWTO] - Create Preservation Files of CP/M Boot Floppy's - KryoFlux Support Forums

forum.kryoflux.com

Larry

This did the trick! Seems like the only thing I was missing was how the format flags need to be arranged on the command line, as I now was able to get a good reading via the following:

$ dtc -finput/track -i0 -m1 -z0 -g0 -n+16 -s0 -e34 -foutput.img -i3

I don't see the neat strings diskblitz has in the screenshot in the output (maybe I have the wrong encoding / endianess on my end) but now all the reads came back clean, except for the one bad sector. I can't believe it was that what kept me stumped. Thanks again!

Cheers
mikerofone

 

[olePigeon]

@mikerofone I can't recommend the AppleSauce enough. I had been on the fence for a long time on getting a Kyroflux, but the lack of support for variable rate 400K and 800K Macintosh disks (my main interest) kept me from getting one. From what I had read, it requires a very specific model of floppy drive, and even then it's not guaranteed to work. When the Rev. 1 AppleSauce was released, I snagged it immediately. Native drive support was just perfect. Then the Rev. 2 was released with PC floppy support, and I no longer had any need for a Kyroflux. AppleSauce is a one-stop-shop with amazingly easy to use software with a fantastic looking GUI. Also, the new .MOOF disk image format is incredible. Being able to play copy protected games via a disk emulator is just awesome.

I'm anxiously awaiting a Linux and Windows client. Hopefully one is in the works. However, I have wondered if it'd work anyway by using a VM.

 

[shirsch]

Applesauce software works reasonably well in a Mac OSX VM under Linux. But, with older Mac prices being so reasonable you may want to think about a dedicated machine. I was given a 2010 Macbook Pro 13" that performs quite well after memory upgrade and SSD drive installation.